Emira JB4 Tuning Now Available for I4 & V6 Cars!

[kitkat]

Yes. This was with Map 1 and actual 91 octane gas. It looks like some or most of the people posting dynos of Map 1 still have 93 in the tank, which would allow Map 1 to operate right to its limit due to the extra headroom against knocking the 93 would have. I don't have 93 available so I can't do a Map 1 - Map 2 comparison.

…

The JB4 dyno I got showed what I felt when switching to Map 1; a definite increase in torque at the lower rpms. What it also shows, is that through multiple dyno pulls spread out over a year with several different mods, once the rpms get close to 5k all the lines pretty much join together. That tells me the exhaust is the bottleneck. I believe all the people showing bigger gains have deleted their 3rd cat which would reduce back pressure and allow for more performance. Most people also seem to be using Dynojets while I'm on a hub dyno which are known to be more conservative.

In order to give you some reference data, the dyno showing meow’s +57whp gain was on pump ACN91 with a bottle of Boostane shot — the tiny little bottle. He only has a valve controller no other modifications. Ambient was around 85F and it was on a hub dyno as well. The numbers were similar without and with the boostane shot.

 

[Eagle7]

In order to give you some reference data, the dyno showing meow’s +57whp gain was on pump ACN91 with a bottle of Boostane shot — the tiny little bottle. He only has a valve controller no other modifications. Ambient was around 85F and it was on a hub dyno as well. The numbers were similar without and with the boostane shot.

So that's on an otherwise totally stock car? Do you have the dyno chart you can post? I'd like to see how the power curve developed.

 

[mr.suntorytime]

So that's on an otherwise totally stock car? Do you have the dyno chart you can post? I'd like to see how the power curve developed.

Emira JB4 Tuning Now Available for I4 & V6 Cars!

Had some pretty good power gains from Map 1 with a friend's car yesterday on JB4 on a dynapack yesterday. Had some trouble getting the car into test mode initially but the car gained 57.9whp and 33.7 lb-ft over stock and all he has is a valve controller. Oddly map 2 with ACN91 + boostane shot...

www.emiraforum.com

 

[Brokenblinker]

So that's on an otherwise totally stock car? Do you have the dyno chart you can post? I'd like to see how the power curve developed.

Seems like there's some confusion, so compiling it all here (from posts from @sendmeows and @kitkat, I don't have any insider info).

Setup Details:

• Car Details: valve controller, no other modifications.
• Ambient temp: around 85 deg
• Dyno Details: hub dyno, all figures taken same day in same session.

Labeled Dyno Plot:

* Power of green line is approximated by looking at legend. Power of red and peak taken off bottom details

Dyno Figure Legend:

red	stock	~332HP
green	map1 + 91	~372HP (+40)
lightblue	map1 + "93"	~390HP (+58)
grey	map2 + "93"	~390HP (+58)

* 93 was approximated via 91 fuel + a boostane shot.


Interestingly, it also looks like map1 with 91 octane would have made more power if run all the way to redline like the others....

 

[kitkat]

Yup good summary.

 

[sendmeows]

Seems like there's some confusion, so compiling it all here (from posts from @sendmeows and @kitkat, I don't have any insider info).

Setup Details:

• Car Details: valve controller, no other modifications.
• Ambient temp: around 85 deg
• Dyno Details: hub dyno, all figures taken same day in same session.

Labeled Dyno Plot:
View attachment 69053
* Power of green line is approximated by looking at legend. Power of red and peak taken off bottom details

Dyno Figure Legend:

red	stock	~332HP
green	map1 + 91	~372HP (+40)
lightblue	map1 + "93"	~390HP (+58)
grey	map2 + "93"	~390HP (+58)

* 93 was approximated via 91 fuel + a boostane shot.


Interestingly, it also looks like map1 with 91 octane would have made more power if run all the way to redline like the others....

thanks for summarizing. the green 372hp line was our first successful run. subsequent runs were to redline at 370 and 368.

 

[Citizen]

Hey guys,

After following this thread closely and finally pulling the trigger on a JB4, I’ve got to say… I’m a bit disappointed with the results.

My car has a 3rd cat delete + Milltek open valve.

A buddy here in Dubai (also on this forum) installed his JB4 before me, so we ran some tests — my car stock (with the mods mentioned above) vs his car with the exact same mods + JB4.

Honestly, the results were underwhelming. From a 40 to 140 pull, the difference was basically 1 m length in his favor… nothing crazy.

Fast forward a few weeks, I installed my own JB4, and… I can’t feel any real difference, apart from whatever my brain wants to believe because of placebo or wishful thinking.

Apparently, in Dubai we don’t have the equivalent of US 93 octane. We’ve got 98 here, which is basically equivalent to 91 for Map 1 — and yeah… no noticeable difference.

To be fair, it’s summer here, and our insane heat probably isn’t helping the car’s performance, but still… I expected to at least see more of a gap between stock and JB4.

P.S.: Why has no one in the US posted any stock vs JB4 race videos yet?

 

[Tomwa]

Not many folks get together to do drag or street light races, it's pretty solidly outside the "intended use case" for the Emira.

If there's really strong interest I'm sure it could be arranged, but it's just not a priority.

I suspect your 91 octane equivalent and high temps are really keeping you from enjoying the benefits.

 

[Eagle7]

Seems like there's some confusion, so compiling it all here (from posts from @sendmeows and @kitkat, I don't have any insider info).

Setup Details:

• Car Details: valve controller, no other modifications.
• Ambient temp: around 85 deg
• Dyno Details: hub dyno, all figures taken same day in same session.

Labeled Dyno Plot:
View attachment 69053
* Power of green line is approximated by looking at legend. Power of red and peak taken off bottom details

Dyno Figure Legend:

red	stock	~332HP
green	map1 + 91	~372HP (+40)
lightblue	map1 + "93"	~390HP (+58)
grey	map2 + "93"	~390HP (+58)

* 93 was approximated via 91 fuel + a boostane shot.


Interestingly, it also looks like map1 with 91 octane would have made more power if run all the way to redline like the others....

Thank you for the summary. What surprises me the most is the baseline stock number of 332 hp. My absolutely stock baseline was 369 which I got right after the 1,000 mile break-in. The pull after installing the Eventuri was 386 hp. The last pull a week ago with the JB4 was 391, which is essentially the same as this car with Map 2 and the derived 93.

The baseline run on my car showed 303 lbft of torque, and with all the mods it's never gotten above 318 lbft. However on the above chart that car's baseline which was 300 lbft (basically same as mine), showed a much bigger gain to 335 with the JB4, taking a jump at about 3,800 rpm.

The biggest surprise to me is my car having 37 more hp stock than his. The drivetrain loss on mine (assuming the factory rating of 400 is pretty accurate, 400-369.6) was 7.6%. His (400-332) is 17%. Doesn't look like these engines are SAE rated.

If as many people who get the JB4 can get baseline/JB4 dyno charts and post them here, we'll begin to get an idea of the performance range of the V6. It'll be interesting to see what the average drivetrain loss is. Either mine's a fluke at 7.6%, or the engine was putting out much more than the factory stated 400 hp. If there's a fairly large variance of power output stock, that's going to have an effect on the gains and numbers posted for the JB4.

 

[Eagle7]

Hey guys,

After following this thread closely and finally pulling the trigger on a JB4, I’ve got to say… I’m a bit disappointed with the results.

My car has a 3rd cat delete + Milltek open valve.

A buddy here in Dubai (also on this forum) installed his JB4 before me, so we ran some tests — my car stock (with the mods mentioned above) vs his car with the exact same mods + JB4.

Honestly, the results were underwhelming. From a 40 to 140 pull, the difference was basically 1 m length in his favor… nothing crazy.

Fast forward a few weeks, I installed my own JB4, and… I can’t feel any real difference, apart from whatever my brain wants to believe because of placebo or wishful thinking.

Apparently, in Dubai we don’t have the equivalent of US 93 octane. We’ve got 98 here, which is basically equivalent to 91 for Map 1 — and yeah… no noticeable difference.

To be fair, it’s summer here, and our insane heat probably isn’t helping the car’s performance, but still… I expected to at least see more of a gap between stock and JB4.

P.S.: Why has no one in the US posted any stock vs JB4 race videos yet?

Altitude, temperature and humidity will have an effect. Here's a short excerpt on the effect of ambient temperature on engine performance:

"High ambient temperatures can significantly impact engine performance by altering the thermodynamic conditions under which the engine operates. As temperatures rise, the air density decreases, leading to lower oxygen levels in the intake air. This reduction can result in less efficient combustion, affecting power output and overall engine efficiency."

High altitudes and humidity can affect power too. You're almost at sea level but with a high humidity; the average humidity of Dubai is 60%. Humidity in the air reduces the amount of oxygen available for combustion, so the higher the humidity, the less oxygen, the less power. Now combine your very high temperatures and humidity, that's literally the worst conditions for an engine to produce power.

Were you able to view the meters on the JB4 app to see what the IAT was?

 

[Brokenblinker]

Thank you for the summary. What surprises me the most is the baseline stock number of 332 hp. My absolutely stock baseline was 369 which I got right after the 1,000 mile break-in. The pull after installing the Eventuri was 386 hp. The last pull a week ago with the JB4 was 391, which is essentially the same as this car with Map 2 and the derived 93.

The baseline run on my car showed 303 lbft of torque, and with all the mods it's never gotten above 318 lbft. However on the above chart that car's baseline which was 300 lbft (basically same as mine), showed a much bigger gain to 335 with the JB4, taking a jump at about 3,800 rpm.

The biggest surprise to me is my car having 37 more hp stock than his. The drivetrain loss on mine (assuming the factory rating of 400 is pretty accurate, 400-369.6) was 7.6%. His (400-332) is 17%. Doesn't look like these engines are SAE rated.

If as many people who get the JB4 can get baseline/JB4 dyno charts and post them here, we'll begin to get an idea of the performance range of the V6. It'll be interesting to see what the average drivetrain loss is. Either mine's a fluke at 7.6%, or the engine was putting out much more than the factory stated 400 hp. If there's a fairly large variance of power output stock, that's going to have an effect on the gains and numbers posted for the JB4.

As a reminder, the absolute value of different dynos cannot be compared to each other, nor can runs from different ambient conditions or days.

This is the reason it is so important to do back to back. Your baseline number cannot be compared to this number whatsoever. Only differentials from back to backs can be compared. It is likely that this dyno just generally reads about 10% lower than yours. Or that the ambient conditions were 10% worse. Or some combination.

If anything, the fact that the overall reading was lower is an indicator that the gains were about 10% LARGER than notated.

 

[Brokenblinker]

Hey guys,

After following this thread closely and finally pulling the trigger on a JB4, I’ve got to say… I’m a bit disappointed with the results.

My car has a 3rd cat delete + Milltek open valve.

A buddy here in Dubai (also on this forum) installed his JB4 before me, so we ran some tests — my car stock (with the mods mentioned above) vs his car with the exact same mods + JB4.

Honestly, the results were underwhelming. From a 40 to 140 pull, the difference was basically 1 m length in his favor… nothing crazy.

Fast forward a few weeks, I installed my own JB4, and… I can’t feel any real difference, apart from whatever my brain wants to believe because of placebo or wishful thinking.

Apparently, in Dubai we don’t have the equivalent of US 93 octane. We’ve got 98 here, which is basically equivalent to 91 for Map 1 — and yeah… no noticeable difference.

To be fair, it’s summer here, and our insane heat probably isn’t helping the car’s performance, but still… I expected to at least see more of a gap between stock and JB4.

P.S.: Why has no one in the US posted any stock vs JB4 race videos yet?

Yeah, definitely your ambient 114f temperatures and type of fuel you have access to is limiting the fun. Hopefully you get to try it in cooler months as well.

My friends and I do lots of car swapping, and people were shocked at how much more power it had. I back to backed it with a Spyder RS, and I wouldn't be surprised if the Emira is faster accelerating on map 2 (except for shifts)

 

[Nova]

Hey guys,

After following this thread closely and finally pulling the trigger on a JB4, I’ve got to say… I’m a bit disappointed with the results.

My car has a 3rd cat delete + Milltek open valve.

A buddy here in Dubai (also on this forum) installed his JB4 before me, so we ran some tests — my car stock (with the mods mentioned above) vs his car with the exact same mods + JB4.

Honestly, the results were underwhelming. From a 40 to 140 pull, the difference was basically 1 m length in his favor… nothing crazy.

Fast forward a few weeks, I installed my own JB4, and… I can’t feel any real difference, apart from whatever my brain wants to believe because of placebo or wishful thinking.

Apparently, in Dubai we don’t have the equivalent of US 93 octane. We’ve got 98 here, which is basically equivalent to 91 for Map 1 — and yeah… no noticeable difference.

To be fair, it’s summer here, and our insane heat probably isn’t helping the car’s performance, but still… I expected to at least see more of a gap between stock and JB4.

P.S.: Why has no one in the US posted any stock vs JB4 race videos yet?

Race videos are less reliable than dyno charts. There are many more variables in a race video. Hopefully you'll see a bigger difference in cooler temps.

 

[sendmeows]

Thank you for the summary. What surprises me the most is the baseline stock number of 332 hp. My absolutely stock baseline was 369 which I got right after the 1,000 mile break-in. The pull after installing the Eventuri was 386 hp. The last pull a week ago with the JB4 was 391, which is essentially the same as this car with Map 2 and the derived 93.

The baseline run on my car showed 303 lbft of torque, and with all the mods it's never gotten above 318 lbft. However on the above chart that car's baseline which was 300 lbft (basically same as mine), showed a much bigger gain to 335 with the JB4, taking a jump at about 3,800 rpm.

The biggest surprise to me is my car having 37 more hp stock than his. The drivetrain loss on mine (assuming the factory rating of 400 is pretty accurate, 400-369.6) was 7.6%. His (400-332) is 17%. Doesn't look like these engines are SAE rated.

If as many people who get the JB4 can get baseline/JB4 dyno charts and post them here, we'll begin to get an idea of the performance range of the V6. It'll be interesting to see what the average drivetrain loss is. Either mine's a fluke at 7.6%, or the engine was putting out much more than the factory stated 400 hp. If there's a fairly large variance of power output stock, that's going to have an effect on the gains and numbers posted for the JB4.

I would be interested to see you run your dynos again with map0, then map1 on the same day and session for a true comparison.

 

[Eagle7]

As a reminder, the absolute value of different dynos cannot be compared to each other, nor can runs from different ambient conditions or days.

This is the reason it is so important to do back to back. Your baseline number cannot be compared to this number whatsoever. Only differentials from back to backs can be compared. It is likely that this dyno just generally reads about 10% lower than yours. Or that the ambient conditions were 10% worse. Or some combination.

If anything, the fact that the overall reading was lower is an indicator that the gains were about 10% LARGER than notated.

Of course the absolutes can't be compared. Due to the MANY variables, all of it is relative anyways. I look for ratios and percentages. I'm up at 2,700 ft altitude here, so the results I get are going to be different from what some of you on the coasts get.

My baseline number is relative to the factory stated power, so it can be compared to somebody else's for the purpose of calculating drivetrain loss. Unless the V6 is SAE rated, the power output can vary quite a bit. The reason why the SAE rating was developed was to keep auto manufacturers honest about the power output numbers they were claiming for their engines. Manufacturers were over-stating the numbers for sales purposes, but would sandbag and understate them if those production cars were going to be used for a racing series, like Chevy's Trans Am Camaros that had 295 hp on the air cleaner can, but were actually putting out 350 or more.

If anybody wants to humor the old guy who doesn't know what he's doing, I would still appreciate the baseline dyno charts to see how much of a difference between rated and actual power people are getting. So now I expect a few lol's to this post and at least one face palm, or I'm going to be VERY disappointed at you guys.

 

[Eagle7]

I would be interested to see you run your dynos again with map0, then map1 on the same day and session for a true comparison.

Alright. After I get the delete pipe installed and everything I've got scheduled to do, I'll drop the $154 for another run and post the results. I'll do a Map 1 first, then see if he'll do a Map 0 for me without an extra charge. I've done enough runs there that I think I can talk him into it.

How about some predictions on what the results will be, compared to the charts I've already posted? Compared to my last pull 8 days ago, I predict a mild increase in torque all the way up the scale, and a slight increase in hp, but mostly above 4k rpm.

 

[Porter]

It will take a lot more than SAE correction to normalize the values between different dynos. Speaking of someone who used to operate more than one kind of dyno: the numbers can only be compared when it's the same dyno on the same day in the same ambient conditions.

Same car same dyno on different days can only be regarded as a loose correlation, not hard data. The ambient conditions make a massive difference. Different fuel in the tank, even if rated the same, can make a big difference too.

Getting information that's informative from a coarse measurement tool like a dynamometer requires both rigorous consistency in operation, and application of intentional strategy. Both to ensure that results are being gathered in a single session, and to ensure that results are intelligently compared, with either explicit recognition or strict elimination of as many extraneous variables as possible. And even in that case it's only valid in the very limited context window of that exact dyno unit on that particular day.

Comparison between different cars on different dynos is like trying to visually estimate the weight of a cloud. It's all a lot of hand waving and wild ass guesses.

 

[Eagle7]

It will take a lot more than SAE correction to normalize the values between different dynos. Speaking of someone who used to operate more than one kind of dyno: the numbers can only be compared when it's the same dyno on the same day in the same ambient conditions.

Same car same dyno on different days can only be regarded as a loose correlation, not hard data. The ambient conditions make a massive difference. Different fuel in the tank, even if rated the same, can make a big difference too.

Getting information that's informative from a coarse measurement tool like a dynamometer requires both rigorous consistency in operation, and application of intentional strategy. Both to ensure that results are being gathered in a single session and intelligently compared to ensure strict elimination of as many extraneous variables as possible. And even in that case it's only valid in the very limited context window of that exact dyno unit on that particular day.

Comparison between different cars on different dynos is like trying to visually estimate the weight of a cloud. It's all a lot of hand waving and wild ass guesses.

I wasn't talking about SAE correction for dynos, I was talking about SAE engine certification which has a very strict tolerance. If I remember right, it's 3% which is not 3 above or 3 below, it's no more than 3% from the stated power rating.

 

[SteveB]

Common paint stripper you can find at hardware stores. Couldn't speak to its quality for such purposes though >_>

Need to exercise caution here, some paint strippers contain dichloromethane! Now banned for use as a paint stripper in most EU countries, but not in others. Dichloromethane (DCM) does not burn and it’s a very aggressive solvent - not the sort of thing you want in your fuel tank!

 

[virtualmacho]

Need to exercise caution here, some paint strippers contain dichloromethane! Now banned for use as a paint stripper in most EU countries, but not in others. Dichloromethane (DCM) does not burn and it’s a very aggressive solvent - not the sort of thing you want in your fuel tank!

Correct. I was referring to pure (99.9%) toluene, the stuff that petrol companies use in their gasoline mixes. It burns but is also a strong solvent, so can't mix too strong.