Toyota 2GR-FE engine vs. BMW B58 (Supra) engine

[~el~jefe~]

Uh. Ok. so you have not "heard" of anything. Did you go on the forums or type into youtube ever:
Supra Engine Oil issues
supra engine replacement

then you will hear of things. I have not heard about Kia's transmission problems as I have never searched for information about that.

Also, a Supra and every time they use that motor, it's a Car, passenger car, front engine, quite heavy. Toyota's fits in a mid-engine sports car use item

The BMW-Supra engine's low oil light does not prevent it from getting engine damage, it also has burnt off, aspirated etc lots of oil which between the meter meaning not much and the odd oil eating combo of the engine, plus the no dry sump, it can fry itself of oil in a couple of ways.

 

[ksegg]

2GR-FE is reliable and proven.

No way I'd opt for the B58 even if it was an option.

Hell, I wouldn't even want my current S55 in the Emira.

 

[FederGigant]

Uh. Ok. so you have not "heard" of anything. Did you go on the forums or type into youtube ever:
Supra Engine Oil issues
supra engine replacement

then you will hear of things. I have not heard about Kia's transmission problems as I have never searched for information about that.

Also, a Supra and every time they use that motor, it's a Car, passenger car, front engine, quite heavy. Toyota's fits in a mid-engine sports car use item

The BMW-Supra engine's low oil light does not prevent it from getting engine damage, it also has burnt off, aspirated etc lots of oil which between the meter meaning not much and the odd oil eating combo of the engine, plus the no dry sump, it can fry itself of oil in a couple of ways.

Not that it's important for us, but this is just bs (and maybe that is to expect from a person saying "everything that BMW makes is ugly") only because it failed on like three guys. I can imagine the typical Toyota Supra buyer by looking at MKIV Supras. They tend to exaggerate things. I know a lot of B58s running stock with bigger turbo at 600 hp+. The crazy guys are running them at a 1000 hp without thinking about it (of course it's modified then). And there are probably a million B58s completely stock out there, because BMW throws that thing in every car they have except the active tourer. It's a better engineered engine in every thinkable way compared to the 2GR FE which is logical and a completely normal thing considering the age of the Toyota unit. And that's not my opinion, but just a fact that anybody that knows a thing or two about engines or even worked on it will confirm. I had this engine for three years, my parents have it in their Z4, a few colleges at work have it, I was active in BMW forums were roughly every second person with a new BMW had it and there was not even one complaint regarding the things you described.
Nevertheless in the Evora I prefer the Toyota engine as well. But it's for emotional reasons like power delivery closer to a na engine, sound, etc. A 374 hp B58 (and probably also the 340 hp version) would outperform the Toyota engine in every thinkable scenario talking acceleration. The B58 has a 100 NM more torque at 1.800 RPM than the 2GR FE at peak torque and just stays there for the next 4.000 revolutions. It's a closed deck block with forged pistons, conrods, crankshaft, a water-cooled intercooler, adjustable camshafts for intake and outtake with variable timing and what not. Every single bit on it is engineered to last.

Oh and by the way: Supra Engine Oil issues -> 2 results on YouTube, Supra engine replacement -> 0 (zero) results on YouTube. Feel free to try it out.

 

[~el~jefe~]

Not that it's important for us, but this is just bs (and maybe that is to expect from a person saying "everything that BMW makes is ugly") only because it failed on like three guys. I can imagine the typical Toyota Supra buyer by looking at MKIV Supras. They tend to exaggerate things. I know a lot of B58s running stock with bigger turbo at 600 hp+. The crazy guys are running them at a 1000 hp without thinking about it (of course it's modified then). And there are probably a million B58s completely stock out there, because BMW throws that thing in every car they have except the active tourer. It's a better engineered engine in every thinkable way compared to the 2GR FE which is logical and a completely normal thing considering the age of the Toyota unit. And that's not my opinion, but just a fact that anybody that knows a thing or two about engines or even worked on it will confirm. I had this engine for three years, my parents have it in their Z4, a few colleges at work have it, I was active in BMW forums were roughly every second person with a new BMW had it and there was not even one complaint regarding the things you described.
Nevertheless in the Evora I prefer the Toyota engine as well. But it's for emotional reasons like power delivery closer to a na engine, sound, etc. A 374 hp B58 (and probably also the 340 hp version) would outperform the Toyota engine in every thinkable scenario talking acceleration. The B58 has a 100 NM more torque at 1.800 RPM than the 2GR FE at peak torque and just stays there for the next 4.000 revolutions. It's a closed deck block with forged pistons, conrods, crankshaft, a water-cooled intercooler, adjustable camshafts for intake and outtake with variable timing and what not. Every single bit on it is engineered to last.

Oh and by the way: Supra Engine Oil issues -> 2 results on YouTube, Supra engine replacement -> 0 (zero) results on YouTube. Feel free to try it out.

everything bmw makes is a glorified passenger car. maybe the z4 is an exception but it is not pretty either. maybe a 10 million dollar F1 car, ok.

 

[FederGigant]

Enough said for me at this point. The initial picture of you I got while reading your first posts here is continuing to form

 

[~el~jefe~]

"I have been measuring my oil almost every week since hearing people saying their MY21's burning oil. Every measurement has always been at max level line. That's even after nearly 4000 miles and a track day.
However, when doing my second oil change at 5000 miles, I measured how much oil came out after I drained it. It came out to be a little less than 6 quarts. I put in exactly 6.5 liters which is about 6.9 quarts for my first oil change. So if my measurements are correct it seems that I have burned about a quart of oil in about 4000 miles. But the oil measurement still said it was max.
It seems the car's oil measurement isn't really accurate. I wonder how much oil is in the car when it says the oil level is at minimum."

Hm. that took all of 1.8 seconds to find 150 related articles to oil consumption issues. Toyota's and BMW's reluctance to test it or replace it also is known for this year after running dry or low at times. All around great engine. I am gladyou defend companies. they need your forum posts to make them feel happy. they are important.

 

[FederGigant]

What you say just isn't true, so please stop doing this. This is (or maybe was) the first forum without any trolls and it's a really great place to spend some time (until you entered the party). You can find issue post for every single engine out there. And you really have to dig deep to find anything bad regarding the B58. If you find something it's in a Supra. And you never ever found 150 articles. Fun fact as for the last word I'll ever write to you: the B58 was co-developed by Toyota to fit all their quality standards and meet their targets as well.
You don't like German cars and you don't like Germans, we got it. Still I won't give you the third "good riddance" post this day. I'm sure you can make it happen to get it from somebody else before the end of the day as you seem to be a collector.

 

[PaulP]

so much soy and reeee! here.

bmw made the engine not serviceable to make money and you own one and are defending a purchase and a bad company

Bmw is a top notch automaker. You sound a bit fringe dude. Chill.

 

[p.rob]

so much soy and reeee! here.

bmw made the engine not serviceable to make money and you own one and are defending a purchase and a bad company

Seriously... I have no brand tattooed on my chest, I owned almost any brand Japanese and Euro. BMWs are great fun cars, they have their issues, just like any other car... That's fanboy x1000

Can't wait to see the next M2!

 

[4GIV8M3]

The b58 and s55 and now s58 are an absolute masterpiece especially in comparison to the 2gr-fe. BMW has built some of the best engines ever. Anyone would has experienced an S65 knows how special they can be.

 

[p.rob]

The b58 and s55 and now s58 are an absolute masterpiece especially in comparison to the 2gr-fe. BMW has built some of the best engines ever. Anyone would has experienced an S65 knows how special they can be.

I had a S65 in a 2013 M3 ZCP, the engine really feels like it's derived from motorsport, sound was awsome aswell. Too bad everything else about the car was super touring (brakes, suspension, seats, tires, etc) haha. Only kept that car one year, did not work on the track and would require massive investment to make it work.

Bought a Cayman S instead and never looked back, what a car.

 

[GreenDeal]

Hi, everyone, I drive a Toyota Supra A90 myself with the legendary BMW B 58 engine. The engine runs great, revs easily and has a nice sound. I haven't heard of any of these engines breaking down either. Unless the increase in performance was either carried out unprofessionally or exaggerated a bit too much. My performance increase to 400 HP on my Supra, among other conversions, was carried out by the German tuner "AC Schnitzer". It's relatively expensive, but you get a 3-year guarantee. Nevertheless, I'm looking forward to my Emira with the Toyota engine. I'm sure the car/engine will be just as fun, the BMW B58 again! Maybe here is a little video of my "favorite driver". She is also convinced of the B58 - here in the BMW Z4 (G29). But see for yourself!

 

[GreenDeal]

sorry, now I completely forgot to attach a photo of my Supra ("Black pearl")...

 

[4GIV8M3]

@p.rob yeah unfortunately the only motorsport thing aabout the M cars is the engine. For a track car the cayman is better. Mine is fully modded with literally every mod so it does fine on a track. Much better road car though.

 

[p.rob]

sounds like the newer ones are better as occasionnal track cars, suspension and brakes seem to work quite well. The seats are also much better, especially with the carbon bucket seats.

Bigger wheels and better tires, good brake fluid and performance brake pads and you are good to go.

 

[SlavaUkraini]

@p.rob yeah unfortunately the only motorsport thing aabout the M cars is the engine. For a track car the cayman is better. Mine is fully modded with literally every mod so it does fine on a track. Much better road car though.

lol the new G8x platform did very well on the ring (75th all time fastest lap at 7:30.79) and that was before the xDrive version was released. Road and Track tested a bunch of super cars and the M4 xDrive had the best lateral cornering even compared to the 992 GT3 (they were actually exactly even at 1.81g)

 

[4GIV8M3]

@Rasputin impressive numbers but the car weighs nearly 4000 lbs so it's not even a consideration for a real track car. Great daily drivers though

 

[SlavaUkraini]

@Rasputin impressive numbers but the car weighs nearly 4000 lbs so it's not even a consideration for a real track car. Great daily drivers though

How can you say both “impressive numbers” in reference to its TRACK NUMBERS and “not a real track car” in the same sentence lol.

 

[4GIV8M3]

@Rasputin im guessing you havent tracked much. Just because a car does 1 halo lap at that time doesn't mean it will stay consistent. And at 4000 lbs it obviously won't. You're consumables are used at a much higher rate. No one wants to be replacing pads, tires on a pig like that. So yeah like a dyno queen it can pull some cool numbers. But in repeated use the car will be much slower than a Cayman because a cayman is 1000 lbs lighter.

 

[p.rob]

any heavy track car will have very very high running costs. But some still perform quite well none the less if you can keeo them running.

On my GT4 a set of Cup2 will last 10 track days and 8000km of street driving, not sure you can say the same on an M3. At 2000 canadian dollars a set or 4, you are happy to make them last.