Stock Emira Wheels and Tires

JonFuller

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Thats correct. The hub flange thickness is only that thick so its pointless to make them any longer in that area.
This is the reason you dont want to get too long of bolts if you go the bolt route --they can thread too far in and make contact with the hub/bearing housing.
OK, thanks (y)
 

Eagle7

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Sorry, forgot that I said I would do this.

Here you go.....

Hard to be precise, but taper seat appears to be 61 degrees.

I am assuming they measure the thread length from the bottom of the taper, making the stock bolts about 32mm, but I don't know this for sure. A CSK bolt/screw length is measured from face of head, to tip (ie, overall length), so I really don't know. Those Titanium bolts are quoted as 28mm, would be nice to see a rule next to one.

EDIT: picture shows, thread is 28mm to bottom of taper, so they're probably ok, certainly for stock wheels without spacers.
Okay, based on your picture of the stock lug bolt that's a 28mm thread length. Seat angle is 60 degrees which is pretty standard for aluminum rims. Thank you!
 

kitkat

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Okay, based on your picture of the stock lug bolt that's a 28mm thread length. Seat angle is 60 degrees which is pretty standard for aluminum rims. Thank you!
Also exactly the same bolts as the Evora.
 

JonFuller

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Well, 6 wheels arrived this morning :)
As already stated by Cayman09, they're very well packaged indeed.
Finish is great, and unlike a lot of wheels, the colour, in full gloss, runs right across to the inner rim. Many I've seen, including my Audi A4, F type etc, only really have a show finish on the outward facing side if things, with the inner rim being virtually grey primer.
My plan has been to paint the grooves in the spokes in DV, but I quite like them as they are, so this is to be decided.
Also surprised to see they are stamped JWL, which is I believe a Japanese safety/quality standards thing.

As also reported by Cayman09, the wider rears have a little more dish on the spokes (concave face) than the fronts. (factory wheels have same dish front & rear, with the hub on the rears being deeper to get the offset needed. You can see the heads of the wheel bolts recessed a lot more). I rather like the extra bit of concave on the rears.

Ignore the apparent colour differences between the pics, that's just my iphone getting it wrong.

On face value at least, these are outstanding value!

And my gut feeling is, they're not going to disintegrate when I push the start button.

So far, no one has asked for any VAT or Duty! though I'm sure it's coming :(
 

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Eagle7

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Y'all trust titanium hardware?
The SR-71 was mostly made of titanium. Seemed to work pretty good.. Cruised at Mach 3+ on the edge of the atmosphere. When it landed came in cherry red hot. They had to use a crane to lift the pilots out of the cockpit because the plane was too hot to touch. Had to cool off for 24 hours before the ground crew could service the plane. Did it all again and again and again for decades, so yeah, seems to work pretty good.
 

scc.131.fe

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The SR-71 was mostly made of titanium. Seemed to work pretty good.. Cruised at Mach 3+ on the edge of the atmosphere. When it landed came in cherry red hot. They had to use a crane to lift the pilots out of the cockpit because the plane was too hot to touch. Had to cool off for 24 hours before the ground crew could service the plane. Did it all again and again and again for decades, so yeah, seems to work pretty good.
Everything is alloyed and heat treated to suit (or not suit) the application. No one knows how well suited a "titanium" or "steel" lug bolt/nut is without getting in to the specifics. Even if the info-mercial says "aerospace grade"!
 

Eagle7

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Everything is alloyed and heat treated to suit (or not suit) the application. No one knows how well suited a "titanium" or "steel" lug bolt/nut is without getting in to the specifics. Even if the info-mercial says "aerospace grade"!
OEM's aren't going to include titanium lugs because of cost, and the weight difference from a cheap set of steel lugs isn't enough to matter on most street cars. However I believe Gordon Murray includes them on his cars, but then those cost 7 figures so cost isn't an issue.
 

Speedy Emira

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OEM's aren't going to include titanium lugs because of cost, and the weight difference from a cheap set of steel lugs isn't enough to matter on most street cars. However I believe Gordon Murray includes them on his cars, but then those cost 7 figures so cost isn't an issue.
They would go well with a super light set of wheels and some carbon brakes 😁
 

JonFuller

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That's it mostly, although the amount saved is very small. There are two benefits from removing weight on the hubs/brakes/wheels. One is unsprung rotating weight. It's the most beneficial to remove because it makes it easier for the wheels to start rotating. I've seen different opinions as to how much benefit; some say it's like removing 4 times the static weight from the car, and some say it's like removing 10 times the weight. Whatever the ratio is, if you remove at least 5 lbs per wheel, you can feel it.

The other benefit is you're also removing static weight from the wheels. This helps improve the response time of the springs and shocks (dampers) in controlling vertical movement of the wheel.

Just replacing the stock lug bolts by themselves with titanium isn't enough of a weight difference that you would even notice it on a street build. If you're doing it for performance reasons, the cost doesn't really justify the return on the investment. They're not cheap. I've seen sets going for anywhere from $200 to $1,000 with all kinds of claimed benefits. On a dedicated race car, sure, but not on a street car.

I'm going to get a set of torx head titanium lug bolts mostly because I can afford it, and I like the way they look. Whatever difference the few ounces of weight saved makes, that's just a bonus.

Here's the style I'm looking at:
View attachment 36519
Nicely finished and packaged.
 

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Steve24

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Titanium replacement lugs / bolts have been around for years for Ferraris (and no doubt other cars, but that’s where my knowledge lies) from extremely reputable companies, and I’m not aware of any issues at all.
Beyond the cost, anyway! :)

I‘ll definitely get a set along with the light-weight wheels from Aerie.

Will I notice the difference in performance?
Maybe. Probably not. Who cares?
 

Eagle7

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Titanium replacement lugs / bolts have been around for years for Ferraris (and no doubt other cars, but that’s where my knowledge lies) from extremely reputable companies, and I’m not aware of any issues at all.
Beyond the cost, anyway! :)

I‘ll definitely get a set along with the light-weight wheels from Aerie.

Will I notice the difference in performance?
Maybe. Probably not. Who cares?
You wouldn't notice a difference in performance for just the lugs alone, however you will notice a difference combined with the lighter wheels if you change them all out the same time as when you replace the wheels.

If you have any amount of time driving the car with the factory setup, that's when you'll notice the difference. If you change the wheels and lugs right away when you first get the car, you don't have any experience to compare them to. This is why I'm going to go through the first 1,000 mile break-in period with the car completely stock. I'll have stuff ready, but I want to wait until the break-in is done so I can get a dyno run stock to use as a baseline for measuring improvements.

What you will notice with removing unsprung rotating weight from the wheels, is the car seems a bit lighter on it's feet. It moves forward easier. Turn-in and steering effort seems a bit lighter. For a car with hydraulic steering like the Emira, you should really feel it in the front wheels especially.
 

JonFuller

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Did you buy a set? Can you weigh them?
I did.
Not in a position to weigh them until Wednesday, as I'm away at the moment with work.
I didn't buy them with weight saving in mind to be honest, I just thought they looked rather smart, and different.

Jon
 

AndyVX

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Y'all trust titanium hardware?
One of the guys I go to track days with has a track prepared M3 had titanium wheel studs and they fractured on track. Lucky he caught it before the wheel came off. Ended up needs new hubs as the fractured studs could not be drilled out
 

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One of the guys I go to track days with has a track prepared M3 had titanium wheel studs and they fractured on track. Lucky he caught it before the wheel came off. Ended up needs new hubs as the fractured studs could not be drilled out
Yeah, I'd rather do a lighter weight CrMo steel alloy rather than a Ti fastener. Ti is technically stronger but not as tough through high-G impacts. Also, the diameter and thread pitch of a lug bolt (or nut) are engineered for the specific properties of steel... on a system designed from scratch for a Ti fastener they'd use a different one.
 
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Eagle7

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One of the guys I go to track days with has a track prepared M3 had titanium wheel studs and they fractured on track. Lucky he caught it before the wheel came off. Ended up needs new hubs as the fractured studs could not be drilled out
There are a lot of other factors involved in that which we don't know. How long were the studs in use, what torque setting was used, did your friend re-torque the lugs each time after coming in hot off the track, what wheels were being used, weights of the wheels and car, what grade level of titanium were the studs, etc. A lot of different things can be involved.

My set is on order, and I'm not in the least worried about it.
 

Speedy Emira

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There are a lot of other factors involved in that which we don't know. How long were the studs in use, what torque setting was used, did your friend re-torque the lugs each time after coming in hot off the track, what wheels were being used, weights of the wheels and car, what grade level of titanium were the studs, etc. A lot of different things can be involved.

My set is on order, and I'm not in the least we worried about it.
You are spot there because poor quality titanium or manufacturing is worse than a quality grade of steel manufactured to a high standard. Strangely as I’m typing this I’m watching the end of a YouTube program called Who Sank the Titanic. 100 years after it happened through tests found the rivets failed and it was found the cast iron ones were grade 3 and not the 4 that should have been used.
 
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