Emiras advertised for sale on other sites

[Mctaff]

It’s catch22

If the market is strong enough to support flippers it means better residuals and lower TCO… if buying new anyway…

Poor residuals mean greater overall cost for the owner, unless it’s a forever car

 

[Wake]

I think it'll depreciate in a very similar way to every other Lotus. It'll have OK residuals but you're still going to see 6 month old V6 FEs at around £70k by July next year and heading towards 50% of list by 3 years old.

Do you not think we are likely to see something similar to Alpine prices? Where they launched with a premiere edition (first edition) at 49k and then when the own spec cars came to market for 50k it inflated the price of Premiere Editions that had all the options ticked.

Obviously own spec cars for the Emira won’t start at more expensive than the FE, but if the base price goes up by the amounts expected then to get a similar spec as a FE you would be paying a fair bit more than the early cars have cost. I would have thought because of that the early “locked in price” FEs will stay at around list price for the first year.

 

[Willma]

It’s catch22

If the market is strong enough to support flippers it means better residuals and lower TCO… if buying new anyway…

Poor residuals mean greater overall cost for the owner, unless it’s a forever car

For me it's a forever car.

 

[Beady]

I guess if the flippers / short termers now pull out, there probably won’t be much on the used market for maybe a couple of years ?

 

[emiraspain]

@emiraspain - I can't wait for the next rant.... " If it was blue, launch car etc....."

You know Im right, I will prove it in a few weeks
the sales brochure colour always sells better...ask Doug M...
Well the final price, albeit close to 90k, which was my low end estimate, is a real disappointment to all, or it certainly should be as it gives some small indication of things to come.........
THere will be a blue one on there soon I guess and who knows what else, we shall see how they progress, but if they start to sell close to 80k already, ie not even recovering cost price on the road, this is BAD news, sorry, but very BAD news

 

[Lotustoronto]

Do you not think we are likely to see something similar to Alpine prices? Where they launched with a premiere edition (first edition) at 49k and then when the own spec cars came to market for 50k it inflated the price of Premiere Editions that had all the options ticked.

Obviously own spec cars for the Emira won’t start at more expensive than the FE, but if the base price goes up by the amounts expected then to get a similar spec as a FE you would be paying a fair bit more than the early cars have cost. I would have thought because of that the early “locked in price” FEs will stay at around list price for the first year.

hmmmm maybe.... except the i4 f/e still coming next year / 2024.... and base i4 which is significantly less.

I think the Emira V6 F/E is top of the range, and Lotus will have to be very careful on how they price the base V6....

 

[jimbobc]

Do you not think we are likely to see something similar to Alpine prices? Where they launched with a premiere edition (first edition) at 49k and then when the own spec cars came to market for 50k it inflated the price of Premiere Editions that had all the options ticked.

Obviously own spec cars for the Emira won’t start at more expensive than the FE, but if the base price goes up by the amounts expected then to get a similar spec as a FE you would be paying a fair bit more than the early cars have cost. I would have thought because of that the early “locked in price” FEs will stay at around list price for the first year.

My Premiere edition was £51,805 new and a Pure to a similar spec with the £1656 paint came in around £54k I think

 

[Lotustoronto]

You know Im right, I will prove it in a few weeks
the sales brochure always colour sells better...ask Doug M...
Well the final price, albeit close to 90k, which was my low end estimate, is a real disappointment to all, or it certainly should be as it gives some small indication of things to come.........
THere will be a blue one on there soon I guess and who knows what else, we shall see how they progress, but if they start to sell close to 80k already, ie not even recovering cost price on the road, this is BAD news, sorry, but very BAD news

Honestly, I do not think that these sales are a direct reflection of the car itself but more of a mixture of horrible timing/economy for Lotus, coupled with terrible delays and comms. They have not shaken off the good old "Lot's of trouble usually serious' as of yet. This needs to be a priority. Yet to see....

Lotus is somewhat well represented in the UK market, dealership wise and I honestly feel that it's residuals should be pretty good. However, this should serve as a warning to ROW, especially those that lack dealer network.

 

[Tonyshepp]

10% - £8k profit over the on the road price on one of first market should be a warning for anyone buying just to flip.

You won’t be alone and as more hit the market prices will be less than the first cars to market, that’s proven time and time again. Especially as many buyers at this level are finance buyers. Perfect storm with 8.9 %Apr

Seems Lotus haven’t lucked out on the timing. And their poor comms and build slot allocation approach has alienated allot of prior die hard customers.

After driving it I was going to get in Feb, use for a bit a flip at start of summer. I know a few who were and now cancelling / already cancelled = expect allot of people to get pull forward calls in the coming days!

And a lot of people saying No it’s ok I’ll wait. Wait and see how early next year plays out.

 

[emiraspain]

It seems on here many think that there are a high % of flippers and I feel thats not true.

How many cars are for sale out of all of those delivered in the EU, 1 2 3 cars max and they are from dealers for the main part, who maybe didnt fill the slot or cancelled etc. No flippers I think, or maximum 1.

In the UK, there have been, maybe 30 40 cars delivered or soon will be... and there are 1 2 3 for sale, or again, will be soon.
1 is due for sale down to the poor quality finish apparently and wants nothing to do with it, so NOT a flipper.
Another had circumstances change.... and then maybe one person looking to flip it.
I think this whole subject is over done..... the subject is used/resale pricing, and not flipping. I dont think flipping is a big thing for the Emira. This is not a GT3 or 4 or spyder etc, it should sell for a good price, but no where near an RS or GT3, there will simply be too many of them and it simply is not special enough, apart from the looks.

If there are cancellations, and there will be, I dont think its flippers, its people who are let down by CS and expected more from the car, an updated / uprated Evora, which it kind of is and isnt at the same time. Interest rates going up and a looming recession for 18/24 months are reasons there will be cancellations, NOT flippers pulling out.
The only change now is that those who have changed their mind about the car for whatever reason, those who thought they may as well take the car and sell it, will now cancel..... as they risk losing money otherwise.
Im in this position, but for the moment I will still take the car..... and its still possible I will keep it...one of them... however, I also like the idea of getting one for 10% less when the weather is better.
I for one am not fussy about spec, alcantara, leather, yellow calipers black, Im an adult, makes no real difference. The only thing I wont tolerate is a blacky greeny greyey colour.. haha

 

[Mctaff]

special offer, you can buy my lightly used blacky greeny greyey one for 87.5k

can't say fairer than that!

 

[emiraspain]

special offer, you can buy my lightly used blacky greeny greyey one for 87.5k

can't say fairer than that!

Id rather keep my unused bluey blue BLUE one for 81k..... and I know mine wont have any faults at alllllllllllll

 

[Mctaff]

Id rather keep my unused bluey blue BLUE one for 81k..... and I know mine wont have any faults at alllllllllllll

just like the owner huh 🙃

 

[Dommo]

It seems on here many think that there are a high % of flippers and I feel thats not true.

How many cars are for sale out of all of those delivered in the EU, 1 2 3 cars max and they are from dealers for the main part, who maybe didnt fill the slot or cancelled etc. No flippers I think, or maximum 1.

In the UK, there have been, maybe 30 40 cars delivered or soon will be... and there are 1 2 3 for sale, or again, will be soon.
1 is due for sale down to the poor quality finish apparently and wants nothing to do with it, so NOT a flipper.
Another had circumstances change.... and then maybe one person looking to flip it.
I think this whole subject is over done..... the subject is used/resale pricing, and not flipping. I dont think flipping is a big thing for the Emira. This is not a GT3 or 4 or spyder etc, it should sell for a good price, but no where near an RS or GT3, there will simply be too many of them and it simply is not special enough, apart from the looks.

If there are cancellations, and there will be, I dont think its flippers, its people who are let down by CS and expected more from the car, an updated / uprated Evora, which it kind of is and isnt at the same time. Interest rates going up and a looming recession for 18/24 months are reasons there will be cancellations, NOT flippers pulling out.
The only change now is that those who have changed their mind about the car for whatever reason, those who thought they may as well take the car and sell it, will now cancel..... as they risk losing money otherwise.
Im in this position, but for the moment I will still take the car..... and its still possible I will keep it...one of them... however, I also like the idea of getting one for 10% less when the weather is better.
I for one am not fussy about spec, alcantara, leather, yellow calipers black, Im an adult, makes no real difference. The only thing I wont tolerate is a blacky greeny greyey colour.. haha

I disagree. I think this has been a flipper's dream in the UK.....until now. £3-5k deposit (fully refundable), launched during the peak of the secondhand car price rise - making people feel like it was a safe bet, low interest rates at the time of launch and until 6 months ago.......All of these would've brought a bunch of speculators into the mix.

Fast forward to now, and there's high interest rates, recession, cost of living crisis, second hand car prices on the decline (quickly), wrong time of the year to sell any car, let alone a sports car and mixed reviews on the car coupled with some teething issues and now the first car selling for only £8k over list . Seems like the perfect storm for not only the flippers to bail out but the genuine buyers being forced out financially.

I personally think it's still a safe option for anyone wanting to own and enjoy the car for a year or two and then get out with low depreciation but anyone in it for profit will be out the door in the next week or so.

 

[Lotustoronto]

It seems on here many think that there are a high % of flippers and I feel thats not true.

How many cars are for sale out of all of those delivered in the EU, 1 2 3 cars max and they are from dealers for the main part, who maybe didnt fill the slot or cancelled etc. No flippers I think, or maximum 1.

In the UK, there have been, maybe 30 40 cars delivered or soon will be... and there are 1 2 3 for sale, or again, will be soon.
1 is due for sale down to the poor quality finish apparently and wants nothing to do with it, so NOT a flipper.
Another had circumstances change.... and then maybe one person looking to flip it.
I think this whole subject is over done..... the subject is used/resale pricing, and not flipping. I dont think flipping is a big thing for the Emira. This is not a GT3 or 4 or spyder etc, it should sell for a good price, but no where near an RS or GT3, there will simply be too many of them and it simply is not special enough, apart from the looks.

If there are cancellations, and there will be, I dont think its flippers, its people who are let down by CS and expected more from the car, an updated / uprated Evora, which it kind of is and isnt at the same time. Interest rates going up and a looming recession for 18/24 months are reasons there will be cancellations, NOT flippers pulling out.
The only change now is that those who have changed their mind about the car for whatever reason, those who thought they may as well take the car and sell it, will now cancel..... as they risk losing money otherwise.
Im in this position, but for the moment I will still take the car..... and its still possible I will keep it...one of them... however, I also like the idea of getting one for 10% less when the weather is better.
I for one am not fussy about spec, alcantara, leather, yellow calipers black, Im an adult, makes no real difference. The only thing I wont tolerate is a blacky greeny greyey colour.. haha

I call B/S.... during 2021 and most of 2022 cars, especially Porsche's were going insanely over list price... Here comes along a so called 718 4.0 competitor from the beloved English brand Lotus, and it looks like a damn mini Ferrari.

I assure you well over 20% of that order book was flippers... I assume 80% of those flippers have dropped and if not will be this week. 20% will remain as they still think an extra 5-10K is worth the juice. I would say 50-60% of the original Emira worldwide order book are actually enthusiast or want to own the car. Even on this forum, there has been evidence to support this.

For me I don't care either way, you paid the deposit and waited your turn, do as you wish. I think it's good for the car / brand that it has a high demand. I would love to know Lotus' actual order backlog come March 2023.

 

[emiraspain]

I call B/S.... during 2021 and most of 2022 cars, especially Porsche's were going insanely over list price... Here comes along a so called 718 4.0 competitor from the beloved English brand Lotus, and it looks like a damn mini Ferrari.

I assure you well over 20% of that order book was flippers... I assume 80% of those flippers have dropped and if not will be this week. 20% will remain as they still think an extra 5-10K is worth the juice. I would say 50-60% of the original Emira worldwide order book are actually enthusiast or want to own the car. Even on this forum, there has been evidence to support this.

For me I don't care either way, you paid the deposit and waited your turn, do as you wish. I think it's good for the car / brand that it has a high demand. I would love to know Lotus' actual order backlog come March 2023.

we will never know will we... but this emira was never going to be a GT porshe product.. which are guaranteed to make money, always have done.
I disagree respectfully, but again, with lots of cancellations we can give many reasons.....

 

[emiraspain]

I disagree. I think this has been a flipper's dream in the UK.....until now. £3-5k deposit (fully refundable), launched during the peak of the secondhand car price rise - making people feel like it was a safe bet, low interest rates at the time of launch and until 6 months ago.......All of these would've brought a bunch of speculators into the mix.

Fast forward to now, and there's high interest rates, recession, cost of living crisis, second hand car prices on the decline (quickly), wrong time of the year to sell any car, let alone a sports car and mixed reviews on the car coupled with some teething issues and now the first car selling for only £8k over list . Seems like the perfect storm for not only the flippers to bail out but the genuine buyers being forced out financially.

I personally think it's still a safe option for anyone wanting to own and enjoy the car for a year or two and then get out with low depreciation but anyone in it for profit will be out the door in the next week or so.

again, we will never know.
BUt I now disagree with low depreciation in 2 years. Im with Tom, it will loose around 30-40% in 2 years and thats not healthy compared to its rivals. There are TOO many..and all the factors you mention are against values...

 

[emiraspain]

just like the owner huh 🙃

naturally, or NONE I will admit too.... haha

 

[Lotustoronto]

we will never know will we... but this emira was never going to be a GT porshe product.. which are guaranteed to make money, always have done.
I disagree respectfully, but again, with lots of cancellations we can give many reasons.....

It could have been better than 718 GT4.... but I agree, it arguably is not... at least on paper.

 

[Dommo]

again, we will never know.
BUt I now disagree with low depreciation in 2 years. Im with Tom, it will loose around 30-40% in 2 years and thats not healthy compared to its rivals. There are TOO many..and all the factors you mention are against values...

With Lotus finance currently offering a balloon (guaranteed future value) of £46.5k after 4 years I can't see it losing 40% in 2 years but for anyone financing the car, if it does, then they've had a result