Poll for Those with Paint Blistering / Bubbling Defect

[kchildre]

Apparently the pictures don’t do it justice… it’s definitely paint separating from the bumper cover (I suspect moisture underneath the paint). I first thought it was the PPF coming off and used a wet squegee in an attempt to smooth it out. The bubbles do respond (move around) to the squeegee, but it’s definitely the paint (and not PPF). The missing paint flaked out from behind the PPF when I was attempting to smooth it out… Definitely not something that hit the bumper.

 

[gcmak]

Apparently the pictures don’t do it justice… it’s definitely paint separating from the bumper cover (I suspect moisture underneath the paint). I first thought it was the PPF coming off and used a wet squegee in an attempt to smooth it out. The bubbles do respond (move around) to the squeegee, but it’s definitely the paint (and not PPF). The missing paint flaked out from behind the PPF when I was attempting to smooth it out… Definitely not something that hit the bumper.

Honestly what I think I see in your pics is something I've seen on a few Emiras who have had PPF applied to their rear bumpers but the installers cut the ppf directly on the car - which is fine if they know how to only score the film - but unfortunately they sliced through to the paint and then the paint flakes off on the edge not covered by the PPF.

Perhaps that's not your case but I think I see a fairly squiggly PPF line - which is what took me down the hand cutting path.

Either way that's a bummer, but if the installer did damage, at least you can have them cover a new resprayed bumper for you!

 

[geoffbland]

Changing my vote as I've just found blisters on my car.

 

[SimonT]

Changing my vote as I've just found blisters on my car.

Doors ot tailgate?

 

[geoffbland]

Doors ot tailgate?

Driver's side door. At the top, middle. Posted more details on another thread.
Mine is an early car, built Dec '22. So it has taken nearly 3 years to show up.

 

[SimonT]

Driver's side door. At the top, middle. Posted more details on another thread.
Mine is an early car, built Dec '22. So it has taken nearly 3 years to show up.

17th November 22 for mine, both doors done tailgate being replaced this week.

 

[geoffbland]

17th November 22 for mine, both doors done tailgate being replaced this week.

Yikes! So just the rear quarter-panels left for you then?
How long ago did you have the doors replaced and has the blistering come back on the new doors at all? That's what I'm worried about, given that there's no information from Lotus that neither they nor Teijin know what causes this so it's not fixed on replacement panels.

 

[SimonT]

Yikes! So just the rear quarter-panels left for you then?
How long ago did you have the doors replaced and has the blistering come back on the new doors at all? That's what I'm worried about, given that there's no information from Lotus that neither they nor Teijin know what causes this so it's not fixed on replacement panels.

Had both doors replaced in Feb, they had the car for 3 1/2 weeks, picked it up and someone had washed the car for pick up and looked to have used sandpaper over the whole car, including the new paintwork. I noticed the smallest bubbling on the tailgate at that time and went through the process of checking and ordering a replacement.

The car went in 3rd June for non working usb's in the armrest, work completed last Thursday and on its way for tailgate replacement. I hadn't noticed any return of bubbles in between them having it.

I can't understand why none of the front end has been a problem for anyone, same composites I believe. The dealers paintshop manager said they'd only had 1 other tailgate and no rear quarters so fingers crossed.

Going forward I think owners will just have the bubbling repaired once out of warranty, placement appears to be the same on almost every car.

 

[Nick in Sydney]

Driver's side door. At the top, middle. Posted more details on another thread.
Mine is an early car, built Dec '22. So it has taken nearly 3 years to show up.

Depressing to get three years in, assume you're safe, and then have it show up.

 

[Nick in Sydney]

I can't understand why none of the front end has been a problem for anyone, same composites I believe. The dealers paintshop manager said they'd only had 1 other tailgate and no rear quarters so fingers crossed.

Nope. Teijin only provided the doors, rear quarter panels, and the inner, outer and lower shells of the tailgate.

 

[geoffbland]

I can't understand why none of the front end has been a problem for anyone, same composites I believe. The dealers paintshop manager said they'd only had 1 other tailgate and no rear quarters so fingers crossed.

No, the front bonnet, front wings, roof and tail are different composite - made by Lotus I think.
Front and rear bumper are moulded plastic not composite.
The doors, rear quarters and engine cover are made by Teijin in Portugal, using a special "light-weight" composite. The "blister" issues are only affecting these pieces.

Which dealer are you using?

 

[SimonT]

No, the front bonnet, front wings, roof and tail are different composite - made by Lotus I think.
Front and rear bumper are moulded plastic not composite.
The doors, rear quarters and engine cover are made by Teijin in Portugal, using a special "light-weight" composite. The "blister" issues are only affecting these pieces.

Which dealer are you using?

JCT600 Bradford. Service dept deal with all mechanical warranty work and their accident repair centre do the paintwork bit, 500 yds between them.

How do the front composites differ from the rest?

 

[geoffbland]

How do the front composites differ from the rest?

I'm not entirely sure of the details.

Lotus parts I think use the same factory as the Evora, Elise etc are made in. The Teijen parts are meant to be lighter and thinner using something they call "TCA Ultra Lite" composite. Seems to be some kind of compressed fibreglass, using special glass beads for some of the bulk filler. As far as I can tell "TCA Ultra Lite" composite had not been used on a road car before so Lotus and the Emira were guinea pigs here. It's worth pointing out that Lotus themselves had some similar issues with the Elise and Evora composites that took several years to fully solve.

There's some more detail on this forum in various places and also some here --> https://www.compositesworld.com/new...-supplies-exterior-body-panels-to-lotus-emira

 

[Rupes]

I actually am pleasantly surprised we haven’t seen more bubbling claims from newer model cars.

 

[Blundamous]

Give it another 2-3 years for those newer models to actually show the problem.

 

[NJemira85]

I'm not entirely sure of the details.

Lotus parts I think use the same factory as the Evora, Elise etc are made in. The Teijen parts are meant to be lighter and thinner using something they call "TCA Ultra Lite" composite. Seems to be some kind of compressed fibreglass, using special glass beads for some of the bulk filler. As far as I can tell "TCA Ultra Lite" composite had not been used on a road car before so Lotus and the Emira were guinea pigs here. It's worth pointing out that Lotus themselves had some similar issues with the Elise and Evora composites that took several years to fully solve.

There's some more detail on this forum in various places and also some here --> https://www.compositesworld.com/new...-supplies-exterior-body-panels-to-lotus-emira

I thought I read that corvette used tca? Maybe a different variant

 

[SimonT]

I thought I read that corvette used tca? Maybe a different variant

US factory I'm sure.

 

[NJemira85]

US factory I'm sure.

Low-density SMC: Five-year R&D payoff: Judges at two recent industry events agreed that Continental Structural Plastics’ (Auburn Hills, MI, US) TCA Ultra Lite sheet SMC, used to mold, for example, this very complex, one-piece Corvette right-front fender, is a winner. The CAMX 2015 steering committee gave it the Unsurpassed Innovation award during its October conference in Dallas, TX, US, and a month later, it topped the SPE Automotive Division’s Materials category and was the Grand Award winner at the 45th SPE Automotive Innovation Awards Gala in the Detroit suburbs. Source: SPE Automotive Div.

A new, low-density sheet molding compound (SMC), formulated and molded by Continental Structural Plastics (CSP, Auburn Hills, MI, US), is responsible for reducing mass by 9 kg on body panels for 2016 model year Chevrolet Corvette sports cars from General Motors Co. (GM, Detroit, MI, US). CSP calls the new material TCA (tough Class A) Ultra Lite. At a specific gravity (SG) of 1.2, it offers a 28% mass reduction vs. CSP’s mid-density TCA Lite (1.6 SG) grades, and a 43% reduction vs. conventional 1.9 SG grades of SMC. More importantly, TCA Ultra Lite not only offers mechanical performance comparable to TCA Lite (both feature a matrix of unsaturated polyester from AOC LLC, Collierville, TN, US), but also reportedly bonds more effectively to paint and adhesive. Although this first commercial use of TCA Ultra Lite is on painted Class A body panels, the company says it’s equally appropriate for fabrication of structural parts.

TCA Ultra Lite was introduced as a running change in the summer of 2015 to replace TCA Lite on all Corvette exterior body panels except the hood and roof, which are molded in carbon fiber-reinforced epoxy by another supplier. Notably, neither tooling, process adjustments nor part thickness changes were necessary during the material transition. “One day we were running TCA Lite, and the next day we were running TCA Ultra Lite,” explains Dr. Probir Guha, CSP’s VP, advanced R&D, “and there were no other changes.”

Lightweighting The C8 - MidEngineCorvetteForum.com

Will GM’s “Lightweighting” program apply to the C8? We all sure hope so! We all wish that GM’s extreme success in reducing weight from their vehicles as they change from one generation for that vehicle to the next one, specifically reducing over 5,000 pounds from fourteen (14) of them (an...

www.midenginecorvetteforum.com

I wonder if c7-c8 vettes have had same issues