This would be grade A US BS…

[TXEMIRA]

Imagine if any of this is actually true.

This would be the dumbest thing Lotus could do in the US.

Absolutely 0 people would care about a $1k-$2k shipping charge for an FE if they knew they could find a random dealer within the US and get the car earlier or sooner.

Either the country has one big line or each dealer has some crazy allocation calculation based on whatever.

Deposit 8/1 at Dealer A ends up not getting an FE while Deposit 12/1 at Dealer B does? Absolute BS if true.

We just want to know how it will really work. Please someone find out how the line in the US works. Please.

 

[PaulP]

I think allocations are based on past sales and so some new dealership is not likely to get many or even any FE allocations in my understanding.

 

[TXEMIRA]

I think allocations are based on past sales and so some new dealership is not likely to get many or even any FE allocations in my understanding.

That would also be absolutely terrible.

“We didn’t have much interest in your brand in the past so when we do get interest we will make those interested upset.”

The UK has a line. A simple line. The whole country knows it and how it works.

The US has that dumb porta-potty line that depends on some dumb luck as to when you get to poop. Pick the wrong line? Deal with the smell and longer wait, even though you were at the queue earlier than someone else.

As the UK would say “rubbish”!

 

[PaulP]

I can see the value of supporting dealers who have supported the brand. Porsche certainly does the same - allocations are not just randomly passed out.

 

[TXEMIRA]

I can see the value of supporting dealers who have supported the brand. Porsche certainly does the same - allocations are not just randomly passed out.

Yes. Porsche developed that over time and did well with it at scale.

Definitely award loyalty. Sure.

Allocate the country with inventory.
Let the customers get in line.
Award the dealers closest to where the customers live OR award them by another objective metric.

But please don’t allow a July deposit customer to not get an FE while a December deposit customer does - simply because they called another dealer in the same country. Please no.

 

[FederGigant]

As far as I am informed that is how it works for Germany: We will get 180 Emiras in 2022 for the whole country. I am roughly Number 20 at my dealership which is why they think they should get one for me as well in 2022. That meant to me that they don't know how many cars any specific dealership will get. Only the total number of cars is known to them, but that also implicates (at least in my opinion) that every dealer has it's own line, and probably also that the bigger/better/whatever dealers get more cars than the smaller ones.
If they will do it the same way in the US, than that guy from your first post is probably telling the truth, but doesn't know if thee dealer is getting any cars, because the dealers don't know it in the first place.

 

[SVMLH]

As far as I am informed that is how it works for Germany: We will get 180 Emiras in 2022 for the whole country. I am roughly Number 20 at my dealership which is why they think they should get one for me as well in 2022. That meant to me that they don't know how many cars any specific dealership will get. Only the total number of cars is known to them, but that also implicates (at least in my opinion) that every dealer has it's own line, and probably also that the bigger/better/whatever dealers get more cars than the smaller ones.
If they will do it the same way in the US, than that guy from your first post is probably telling the truth, but doesn't know if thee dealer is getting any cars, because the dealers don't know it in the first place.

Wow just 180 for Germany that is quite low….until now I was hoping for a delivery in summer. When did you make your payment and which dealer did you choose (more important in Germany?)

 

[Bilbao-Emira]

Spain case:
2 dealers for the whole Spain + Portugal (47+10 million population)
Total allocation from Lotus FE 2022. = 12 cars, yes you heard it right !

Now, I am number 1 on the list of the total 12 cars.
if this launch is global (not quite) I should be expecting my car to be in the first batch for the Continental Europe market.
I would be very pissed off if they start delivering to other countries in Europe, aside from UK, and I get relegated in delivery.
Example:
Not that I have anything against Switzerland or any other country:
Heard that Switzerland has 50+ cars allocation for 2022 (8.6 million population)
Germany: 180 allocation, (83 million population)
Understanding that these countries have had in the past much bigger numbers than Spain as Lotus customers, the question falls similar at the the same point as TX-Emira pointed out:

Am I going to have to wait for deliveries to take place before in the rest of Europe or are they going to deliver a minimum percentage equally around all the countries of Europe, which is what I would expect.

In other words, are the early customers in Europe going to be rewarded in the delivery times similar to the line they have stablished for UK (First in line is first delivered), equal regardless of the location?

This is a simple question we are demanding for a few months now and not difficult to answer, if Lotus had it clear.

Just venting out, now I go back to waiting mode

 

[TomE]

I don't have much info on this. I know a little about the current US setup, which is based on each dealer having an annual allocation. For Emira they all got an opportunity to pitch for how many cars they wanted for 2022 and then Lotus decided what each was going to get, based on a number of criteria. At that stage dealers already had some deposits but also had to estimate how many more they wanted on top.

So yes, it's possible for one dealer to take deposits on their entire allocation and another dealer to have no deposits. Whilst that might seem odd and potentially unfair to customers, it's a reasonably sensible approach for a company that sells low volumes and has limited brand awareness and low dealer coverage in a very large country. Each dealer is encouraged to commit to take a set number and sell them.

This is very similar to how it has worked in the US for Elise, Exige and Evora. The contracts between Lotus UK, Lotus USA and dealers are based on that, so a wholesale change is very difficult to do. The UK dealer network is going through the transition to the direct model and it's taking a lot of time and effort. At the moment it looks great and fair for UK customers to have a single queue, but it has significantly reduced the dealer involvement in sales. Lotus have also required continuing UK dealers to commit to significant investment. But with less involvement in sales how do they get a return on that spend? We'll have to see what the longer term impact of that is once cars are with owners.

In the US, Lotus are also developing their dealer network and we're about to see the first public indications of this with 1-2 new dealers announcing before Christmas and more next year. Lotus did an event for dealers as part of the US Emira roadshow and the new and potential dealers were there. Somehow those new dealers have to be given an allocation to sell. It can't be based on prior Lotus sales and they need to create an order book somehow. Lotus don't control the current dealers' books (which each dealer committed to sell), so can't easily shift orders across from current to new in any sort of fair way (to customer or dealer).

I guess it could've been handle in a more thought out way, like asking existing deposit holders if they wanted to move their deposit to a new dealer. But the dealers are going to be unhappy about losing a sale and it being given to a dealer down the road.

Not an ideal situation at all. I've not thought of a different way of doing it that can be put in place quickly and takes account of current arrangements unless it involves a big change. I'd be interested if other people have ideas.

 

[FederGigant]

Wow just 180 for Germany that is quite low….until now I was hoping for a delivery in summer. When did you make your payment and which dealer did you choose (more important in Germany?)

I picked Lotus Leipzig, and was paying first deposit in October so I‘m quite late to the game but I also have a feeling that Emira is not a big thing here in Germany. There is nearly no German content on YouTube for Example regarding Emira.
My dealer also said that 2022 should work for me.

 

[Nova]

How do we know who the new dealers are that are being built?

 

[TXEMIRA]

Hypothetically this makes it worse for dealers for a few reasons:

1. Multiple deposits will be taken and cancelled.

2. More people will have a sales relationship with one dealer and a service relationship with another.

3. Just a bad taste all around.

That’s just the US. I’m not considering the logistics of the entire world and I feel terrible about those in other countries who have it even worse simply because the supply won’t meet the demand (even if low).

Here’s my rub. Do I now go deposit at multiple dealers across the nation knowing I’m only buying one vehicle?

 

[FederGigant]

I think it's just an issue for that specific case, because there are not many dealerships that are built just now and can take allocations. Most of them are established and sold out. And I also thought that Lotus is checking for people doing multiple allocations, but I'm not sure about that.

 

[TXEMIRA]

I think it's just an issue for that specific case, because there are not many dealerships that are built just now and can take allocations. Most of them are established and sold out. And I also thought that Lotus is checking for people doing multiple allocations, but I'm not sure about that.

We all have friends who can do the dirty double deposit in their names to play games. Sad if it’s true for sure.

 

[Mike-engel]

Yes the rumor, if true, is very disheartening. I placed my deposit back in mid July at the North Carolina dealer, to whom I was directed by Lotus incidentally, and at that time the dealer felt confident that a car would be likely in autumn 2022. With all this chatter now I’m not so sure. And my dealer has not even replied to my last two emails. He’s a nice guy, so I’m left to wonder if he’s not reply to me because he’s being told not to and/or has nothing to say. Either of those choices are bad, and again betray this fundamental problem of no communication between Lotus and it’s customers. I get wanting to support the dealers who have stuck with the brand, and how that is at odds with supporting new dealers. But what about supporting your customers? Aren’t they the ones ultimately the ones ponying up the money to buy the car? This is one of the issues with selling through dealerships that are independent entities. For Lotus corporate, the dealer is the customer. If lotus wants to avoid another customer service foible, why don’t they just tell us what is their plan for US distribution and why? In my job as a cancer doctor for children, I appreciate that families fill up their unknown spaces with the worst things they can imagine. The elixir for their anxiety is information! Lotus is really failing at that. I’m sure the car will be epic, and prospective buyers will be willing, in most cases, to wait as long as they know how long and that the distribution process is fair.

 

[TomE]

How do we know who the new dealers are that are being built?

Basically from inside tip offs until they break cover or are officially announced. This example seems to be a case of the dealer announcing it before Lotus was ready to.

Hypothetically this makes it worse for dealers for a few reasons:

1. Multiple deposits will be taken and cancelled.

2. More people will have a sales relationship with one dealer and a service relationship with another.

3. Just a bad taste all around.

That’s just the US. I’m not considering the logistics of the entire world and I feel terrible about those in other countries who have it even worse simply because the supply won’t meet the demand (even if low).

Here’s my rub. Do I now go deposit at multiple dealers across the nation knowing I’m only buying one vehicle?

Lotus have mechanisms in place to try to prevent multiple deposits. But as mentioned above, nothing to stop you and your partner and relatives all placing deposits. Buying from a dealer other than your local one and then having it serviced at your nearest has been a feature right through history, not just in the US and not just for Lotus.

As I said above, I can see this looks poor to customers but how else is an incoming dealer with no Lotus customers and an allocation of 2022 cars supposed to sell them? Anyone who places a deposit with them now is inevitably going to get ahead of people at other dealers who placed deposits months ago. Unless Lotus forces other dealers to give them some of their orders and redistribute the queues. Or tell the new dealer they can only have 2023 allocations, but that doesn't help either.

I really do sympathise with how some people feel about (in effect) queue jumping. On the other hand, people have complained about poor US dealer coverage and there are practical challenges like this with bringing new ones on board. And again, yes, Lotus could do a better job of communicating.

 

[SVMLH]

I picked Lotus Leipzig, and was paying first deposit in October so I‘m quite late to the game but I also have a feeling that Emira is not a big thing here in Germany. There is nearly no German content on YouTube for Example regarding Emira.
My dealer also said that 2022 should work for me.

Ok fingers crossed I chose a dealer in Mainz, but have no idea how many cars they might get, payed my deposit in August.. hopefully you are right, „the Germans“ may prefer the safer choice of a 911 and find the emira to be too exotic We will see..2022 would be nice if it was in summer