'First Edition' availability

[TomE]

I got mine in in August, but still curious on this. I think UK is that way for sure, but in the US, you could easily (IMO) have a situation where dealer allocations aren't in proportion to deposits, and that could create situations where an October deposit could get a car sooner than an August deposit in theory. And if we "bet" on the wrong dealer, they potentially couldn't get enough allocations to fill all of their deposits.

I think some of this will be moot as people opt to wait for i4 or more colors though.

For US this reflects some of the situation. You're right it is dealer-based so it could be possible for two people with the same deposit date at different dealers to have different delivery dates. We don't know how wide that variation could be. Lotus can't dictate the process to be solely date driven across the whole US so every customer gets their car in the exact chronological order compared to every other customer.

But if a dealer fills their current 2022 allocation they can start building a 2023 order book, as many already have. So if you miss a 2022 allocation you will be in line for the 2023 allocation, based on how your dealer runs that next order book. Lotus will determine 2023 allocations based on a number of factors, including number of deposits and prior sales and territories etc.

 

[jmn444]

March for V6 FE globally


Deposit in before March deadline and, if via a non-UK dealer, they have notified the deposit to Lotus.

Thanks! that's pretty wild, and certainly implies the FE production will be far more than the 700 slated for CA and US.

Reading between the lines here, it also seems that it will be quite a long time before you can spec and take delivery of something other than a FE.

 

[TomE]

700 is 2022 only, and it's a provisional figure.

The process for i4 FE and Base specification and ordering will start roughly as planned in 2-3 months time when pricing is published. First deliveries are still aiming at end 2022/start 2023 for i4 FE and sometime in 2023 for the first Base Edition cars of both engine types. There are a lot of factors in play, including when does the second shift start.

 

[jmn444]

700 is 2022 only, and it's a provisional figure.

The process for i4 FE and Base specification and ordering will start roughly as planned in 2-3 months time when pricing is published. First deliveries are still aiming at end 2022/start 2023 for i4 FE and sometime in 2023 for the first Base Edition cars of both engine types. There are a lot of factors in play, including when does the second shift start.

Nice. that will be good to be able to see the diff colors and base + option pricing vs FE for a lot of us. The one upside to being further down the list maybe!

 

[Emira2222]

I just want to make sure I understand things correctly here... Lotus UK have already taken orders with anticipated 1st delivery intended for as early as June 2022? Lotus US (including Canada) is still waiting to make orders and will not take delivery until September 2022 (at the earliest).

I'm getting the sense that when it comes to Lotus UK vs Lotus US, we may not be comparing "apples to apples". The OP's chat was initiated through Lotus UK and I am not sure the response was intended for the US/Canada audience. It's fairly evident that because the UK is already taking orders, the timing still works with the UK scheduling. Therefore, there is no guarantee that Lotus US will operate in the same manner. Especially considering that we are at least 3 to 4 months behind them on delivery.

Now, please correct me if I am wrong... But, I vaguely recall that UK started taking delivery of the original Evora in 2008, and North America didn't get them it until 2009? We may be following a similar trend?

 

[xen]

Given it’s now confirmed that North American FE’s will actually be limited in number does the same apply for all other (non-UK) markets or is NA peculiar in this regard?

 

[Lankan]

Given it’s now confirmed that North American FE’s will actually be limited in number does the same apply for all other (non-UK) markets or is NA peculiar in this regard?

Indeed would be good to know this...

 

[New to Lotus]

Yes this is something I've mentioned a few times, to me a fe is a normal thing to do and a way to reward early depositors who want to support the brand and take some risk. Initially I heard they were looking to do something like 1000 fe cars worldwide of which 600 🇬🇧. Then 1200 🇬🇧 and 2200 worldwide then anybody who wants one can have one as long as they order before the end of march, now its seems 🇺🇸 are capped at 700? What about the rest of the world then. A bit of a mess they would have been better just putting a number on it in the first place. But I do think they have just tried to the best by customers but the unprecedented demand has taken them by surprise.

 

[Jon_N]

This car is so critical to future existence of the brand I don’t see how they could put a small FE limit in place.
Timed limit mentioned as at deposits by end of March will create some scarcity demand at that point, but in the U.K. I’m expecting quite a large volume of FE vehicles to appear over never few years as production catches up….

 

[Mike-engel]

First Editions can be ordered as long as the order is in by the end of March.

Here in the US, where orders are placed through dealers, being able to order a car means your dealer actually answers their phone or calls you back. My dealer is 6hrs away by car. So far that hasn’t gone super well. Could I just call Lotus Cars directly? I placed my deposit, the only one I’ve been asked to make, in July.

 

[Mike-engel]

Well, I've pretty much already decided to wait for the base as I do want more color options and also get any kinks the FE'S may have out. But if they keep extending the FE production, when will the base editions ever start?

The factory is supposed to be able to make all specs concurrently, possibly with some cohosting for production quality and efficiency. So maybe that’s how they solve the FE problem….deposit in by march, FE spec at FE price but when you get it dictated by production priorities. After march? Either continued availability at a different price, or just stop taking deposits for FE cars altogether (at least for the V6). Then after March, all deposits would be for base + desired options. Pricing could be adjusted for new model year. The configurator features could be adjusted to only allow builds and deposits for what is available and at what price. That would seem fair. This way, you get the car you want eventually, you may just have to wait a while based upon demand, deposit date and production schedule. This would seem fair to me.

 

[TXEMIRA]

What if that FE Badge is really an NFT though?

#ForTheLimited

 

[EspritGuy]

The factory is supposed to be able to make all specs concurrently, possibly with some cohosting for production quality and efficiency. So maybe that’s how they solve the FE problem….deposit in by march, FE spec at FE price but when you get it dictated by production priorities. After march? Either continued availability at a different price, or just stop taking deposits for FE cars altogether (at least for the V6). Then after March, all deposits would be for base + desired options. Pricing could be adjusted for new model year. The configurator features could be adjusted to only allow builds and deposits for what is available and at what price. That would seem fair. This way, you get the car you want eventually, you may just have to wait a while based upon demand, deposit date and production schedule. This would seem fair to me.

Ahem. ....There's this small problem of Dealer Allocation. I welcome more NA FE. It looks like you'll get an FE in the form of a Base Model plus add-ons. You won't get it at the FE bundle price. Unless by some marketing miracle lotus applies a Preferred Customer option credit to use at your discretion. They and the dealer know deposit dates and identities. It's just a matter of setting a cutoff. Many of us bet on the Emira before official pricing was announced.
2022 allocations were set for NA and by now accounted for. 2023 are somewhat up for grabs but won't matter until upcoming January. Maybe there is some elasticity there.?
Wondering what this fabled March update will produce. Joy or other.

 

[Mike-engel]

Ahem. ....There's this small problem of Dealer Allocation. I welcome more NA FE. It looks like you'll get an FE in the form of a Base Model plus add-ons. You won't get it at the FE bundle price. Unless by some marketing miracle lotus applies a Preferred Customer option credit to use at your discretion. They and the dealer know deposit dates and identities. It's just a matter of setting a cutoff. Many of us bet on the Emira before official pricing was announced.
2022 allocations were set for NA and by now accounted for. 2023 are somewhat up for grabs but won't matter until upcoming January. Maybe there is some elasticity there.?
Wondering what this fabled March update will produce. Joy or other.

Yeah, I get the allocation issue. But allocations are about “when”, not “what”. Maybe one doesn’t get a car WHEN they want with my hypothesized scenario, but at least they would get WHAT they want for the price that was in place when they made their commitment via their deposit. I agree that the March cutoff seams kind of late. I would have set it a little earlier. But that’s what they have chosen, at least for the UK. We will see what they say. For the time being I will be on the phone with my dealer provided I can get them on the phone to get answers to these questions. But honestly, I’m not sure I’ll be able to trust the answers since there has been such a comms vacuum and folks are getting information that is all over the place. I guess one other thing to do is hop on the chat to ask these questions, then save the transcript, or contact Lotus Cars USA for answers. At least then there would be a record of what is being communicated. Fun, fun, fun.

 

[TomE]

This car is so critical to future existence of the brand I don’t see how they could put a small FE limit in place.
Timed limit mentioned as at deposits by end of March will create some scarcity demand at that point, but in the U.K. I’m expecting quite a large volume of FE vehicles to appear over never few years as production catches up….

They can put a limit in place if they like, then move on to Base + options. I assume they did a deal for minimum quantities with suppliers for the optional packs, so they needed to sell at least those. We don't know how the supplier pricing works after that, so the £3k per car discount for an FE may not be able to be continued after a certain number have been built.

They do need to be clear with people about whether there is a cap on numbers or a time limit, as up until a week ago people were being told they could get an FE based on time limit.

They did 400 Launch Editions for the Evora (fully loaded at a discount, like the FE) and then went to Base + options. It looks like FEs will be well over 1000.

 

[TomE]

Here in the US, where orders are placed through dealers, being able to order a car means your dealer actually answers their phone or calls you back. My dealer is 6hrs away by car. So far that hasn’t gone super well. Could I just call Lotus Cars directly? I placed my deposit, the only one I’ve been asked to make, in July.

In the US I don't think you're allowed to buy direct from Lotus, much as they would like to be able to do that.

 

[Mike-engel]

In the US I don't think you're allowed to buy direct from Lotus, much as they would like to be able to do that.

Bummer

 

[TomE]

Yeah, I get the allocation issue. But allocations are about “when”, not “what”. Maybe one doesn’t get a car WHEN they want with my hypothesized scenario, but at least they would get WHAT they want for the price that was in place when they made their commitment via their deposit. I agree that the March cutoff seams kind of late. I would have set it a little earlier. But that’s what they have chosen, at least for the UK. We will see what they say. For the time being I will be on the phone with my dealer provided I can get them on the phone to get answers to these questions. But honestly, I’m not sure I’ll be able to trust the answers since there has been such a comms vacuum and folks are getting information that is all over the place. I guess one other thing to do is hop on the chat to ask these questions, then save the transcript, or contact Lotus Cars USA for answers. At least then there would be a record of what is being communicated. Fun, fun, fun.

Allocations are also about what. After the reveal in July, NA dealers were asked to pitch for numbers they wanted for 2022 for V6 FE and i4 FE (V6/i4 Base weren't expected to be delivered in 2022 so weren't asked about). They were also asked for an indication of manual/auto transmission split on the V6.

If i4 production had been delivering cars in 2022 (as originally planned) then the recent communication to dealers of their finalised 2022 allocation would have included a mix of V6 FE manual, V6 FE auto and i4 FE. It's now all V6 FEs so appears to people like just one big batch.

Unless your contract at deposit time makes specific reference to it (and no caveats via T&Cs), your deposit doesn't guarantee a specific model at a specific price delivered at a specific time. I know we're all now frustrated that it didn't, but for almost everyone that's the situation.

Even for the folks in the UK who have recently been asked to lock in their spec and have been given a target delivery month, they have no guarantee of a specific price or a specific delivery date. They have still only paid a deposit for a place in a queue, and won't enter into a binding contract until 30 days before delivery. Of course we all hope Lotus don't change the price, or delay or re-sequence the delivery order and I'm sure they're working hard not to. But contractually they can.

 

[Eagle7]

As far as I can tell, the only actual physical difference between an FE and an optioned base model, is the FE badge on the sides, and the center console if you got the auto trans. So apart from those minor badges, the FE bundle is basically a price package. This is something Lotus would have to approve, to extend that offer through the end of March for their registered depositors that were outside of the group that fit within the 700 allocations for NA. It would be a limited offer, and would require designating these additional FE's as part of each dealer's allocation for next year.

This is basically what I'm proposing to Matt, however there could be the issue, again, of quantity. What if a dealer who normally gets allocated 5 cars a year, still has a backlog of 25 deposits? They could use up their entire next year's allocation just for this one model, and STILL have 20 unhappy customers. And this is just now with those who've made deposits. What's going to happen once the general public sees these? Is that same dealer now going to have 50 or more deposits for the i4FE? Or even more for base models? This in my opinion, is the big upcoming serious issue.

I personally think Lotus needs to make a significant push to add more dealerships. Not only for sales, but even more importantly for support. So what happens if they start shipping thousands of Emiras in the next 2 years to NA (they already have 3,000 deposits NOW), and they still only have the same 40 dealers, with the top 5 or 6 being the best? That doesn't even begin to cover the support that's going to be needed. That's going to be the next big hill to climb.

 

[TomE]

There is a programme already running to add more US dealers. I was asked not to share specifics, but many are coming. this year and next.