FIRE!!!

[Stevie1464]

Not quite a fire, more a question about fire extinguishers!!
As in, does anyone have one, if so, what do you have and where do you store in the car/ how do you fasten it down? I've never had one before in any vehicles I've owned, but I watched a Harry's Garage video on YouTube, and his words of "you've never experienced pain until you're forced to watch your car burn at the roadside..." sounded like serious shit and made me think that I took should get one!

 

[JT Ramona CA]

I fabricated a custom metal mount that uses the bolt that also holds the child seat clip in the rear area behind the seats, the biggest concern with a fire extinguisher is having it mounted so it will not come loose in an accident or rollover, would not want to get hit in the head by that thing!

 

[nixx]

Definitely buy a fire stick instead of a traditional extinguisher. A friend experienced an engine fire on a track day and the marshals put it out using a traditional extinguisher. The powder basically ruined every wiring harness, the ECU, and caused more damage than the fire. The powder is really corrosive! The fire sticks don't damage the wiring and metal like traditional extinguishers.

 

[Lotus F1]

Definitely buy a fire stick instead of a traditional extinguisher. A friend experienced an engine fire on a track day and the marshals put it out using a traditional extinguisher. The powder basically ruined every wiring harness, the ECU, and caused more damage than the fire. The powder is really corrosive! The fire sticks don't damage the wiring and metal like traditional extinguishers.

Great idea, Ill get two for the car

 

[jp129]

Definitely buy a fire stick instead of a traditional extinguisher. A friend experienced an engine fire on a track day and the marshals put it out using a traditional extinguisher. The powder basically ruined every wiring harness, the ECU, and caused more damage than the fire. The powder is really corrosive! The fire sticks don't damage the wiring and metal like traditional extinguishers.

There are different types of extinguishing chemicals. Some are corrosive, some are not. They are not all created equal. Do your HW, but I don't advise writing off all "traditional extinguisher" in place of "fire sticks".

If you would like more feedback, talk to a firefighter about effectiveness of different types of extinguishers, especially for flammable liquids/chemicals.

 

[geoffbland]

Whether a fire extinguisher or a stick, also know how they work and how to use them - have a plan in advance to put out different types of fire in different parts of the engine. What is the "throw" of the extinguisher, when do you open the engine cover, how to quench fires in different parts of the engine etc. ? You don't want to be trying to figure this out during a fire.

 

[geoffbland]

OK I just learnt something new - it might be helpful to others here.

In Poland and the Baltic States there's a legal requirement to carry a fire extinguisher in your car, a minimum size of 1KG and it must be an ABC type. It must also be in date with the expiry date clearly marked.

A fire stick is not acceptable here.

 

[Foosh]

That's a good example of regulations being out-of-date and not keeping up with better technology. The Element 50 far more effective and provides 5X longer fire fighting time than a traditional 5lb. tank extinguisher, which weighs 7.5 lbs. It's also rated for all fire types, and there is no expiration date.

Stick a small piece of the prickly side of velcro to the Element fire stick, and it will attach securely to the carpet of any vehicle, so you can quickly take it with you for multiple vehicle use. I just bought one and keep it near my car keys/fobs so I can take along when I'm driving any of our 7 vehicles.

So you have to ask yourself, it is more important to comply with an out-of-date regulation or have a more effective and clean way to put out a fire? Tank extinguishers make a damaging, huge mess. (see post #22).

 

[geoffbland]

Thanks for this. It's not really what I'm speaking about however if you don't want to get a fine in several EU countries.
I would agree that a fire stick can be useful in many circumstances but personally I'm not going to rely solely on a fire stick - I would suggest that everyone does their own research and makes their own decision - I'm not going to recommend any given solution.

A useful start could be searching up something like "Is it likely that track marshals will use fire sticks in the future when regulations allow rather than traditional extinguishers and reasons why or why not?"

And in general don't take advice from strangers on the internet (or worse AI) without doing your own research.

 

[OliverB]

I own a fire sprinkler business so here's my 2 cents. Those fire sticks do not offer the user any kind of safe distance from the flames and the smoke. This video is pretty telling:



The only extinguisher you should have in a performance car is a BC rated Purple K fire extinguisher. If its out of your budget, an ABC or a BC powder dry chemical will also work.

 

[Beachbum]

I own a fire sprinkler business so here's my 2 cents. Those fire sticks do not offer the user any kind of safe distance from the flames and the smoke. This video is pretty telling:



The only extinguisher you should have in a performance car is a BC rated Purple K fire extinguisher. If its out of your budget, an ABC or a BC powder dry chemical will also work.

Damn, is there any walk of life, we dont have covered here ?

 

[Foosh]

Sad to see the provided evidence that the Element fire stick may not be effective for vehicle fires.

Unfortunately, with a sizable fire, a compact, slim, sports car-sized, conventional tank extinguisher (usually 2.5 lbs. or less) isn't likely isn't going to have enough fire-retardant chemicals to extinguish a significant fire. What attracted me to the Element was that it lasts 5X longer than a 5 lb. conventional extinguisher, which is rather large and weighs about 7.5 lbs.

Given that, I'd probably rather deal with a total loss with the insurance company rather than repairing a badly fire-damaged car. However, it would be advisable to have a suitable, much larger (20 lbs.) fire extinguisher in one's garage.

 

[OliverB]

Duration doesn’t really mean anything (even when comparing across different weights due to the difference in pressure) if you are unable to choke the fire. A 2.5lb might last ~10 seconds, but the amount of fine particles delivered to the fire is absurdly high in comparison to that stick. I think having two is a better compromise, compared to a single 5lb, for the Emira. But that’s also more expensive compared to having a single one.

 

[Foosh]

Practically speaking, I still think letting a replaceable car like the Emira burn until the FD arrives is a better alternative than trying to repair one damaged, but not totaled, by a fire you put out yourself. I think the Emira would likely be totaled anyway by almost any fire in the engine bay, no matter how quickly you acted in putting it out with the best available extinguishers.

I definitely want my attached garage and storage barn equipped with 10-20lb. BC extinguishers, but primarily to keep the buildings from burning down.

An almost irreplaceable and very valuable classic car would be a different story.

 

[scc.131.fe]

Practically speaking, I still think letting a replaceable car like the Emira burn until the FD arrives is a better alternative than trying to repair one damaged, but not totaled, by a fire you put out yourself. I think the Emira would likely be totaled anyway by almost any fire in the engine bay, no matter how quickly you acted in putting it out with the best available extinguishers.

I definitely want my attached garage and storage barn equipped with 10-20lb. BC extinguishers, but primarily to keep the buildings from burning down.

An almost irreplaceable and very valuable classic car would be a different story.

This is pretty much my feeling as well. I keep an element in the car and one next to the car in the garage mostly for the unfortunate case that something ignites while the car is inside and I can't move it out. with no wind and reduced air exchange, the element may stand a better chance than the outdoor redneck bbq test method.

I don't run any notable company that gives my two cents street cred but I'm not sure how much similarity there is to the preliminary stage of a car fire vs large established wooden embers. Seems that others have experienced early stages of car fire that are a bit more 'flash in the pan' that can be more easily overcome if you act quickly.

But, just like a firearm, if you have it you can always choose not to use it.

 

[Kaz]

At least in the US yes any hint of fire I think the insurance company will usually total the car. In the I4 there is an engine cover also. When I thought this through I realized I'd have to hold the keyfob down for few seconds...the rear hatch opens. I would have to open this hatch, then remove the engine cover to get to whatever is on fire. That engine cover is carbon fiber so probably that itself is already on fire lol. But yeah I have an element 100 in the even there IS something that little stick can manage. Maybe something in the cabin that just ignited or....something else outside the car like another car or campfire or who knows. Handy to have, but probably not going to get through the two layers of rear engine covers if there is actually a fire back there - probably lol

 

[cellculturist]

I am still prototyping how to hold my extinguisher, this is a first pass at it using 3D prints. Will likely beef up the brackets and have SendCutSend make them for me out of aluminum. The best extinguisher is the one you can quickly reach so I have it bolted just in front of the passenger seat, within my reach. There is a provision to slide it forwards and backwards using thumb screws if I want to move the seat further forward.

As for what extinguisher to use, like others have said I recommend going with something that can dispense a high volume of retardant in a short amount of time. I would not use the element sticks as the primary method to extinguish a fire, and instead have them as a backup in addition to the big boy. I plan to have one in each door pocket so that my passenger and I can grab one on the way out of the car after coming to a stop during a track day or something.

The primary extinguisher I chose is a LifeLine Zero 360 (5lb bottle) that uses Novec 1230 retardant. It's fairly safe to use on sensitive things and is used in some racing applications.